telophase | (no subject)

(no subject)

I was reading my page of "monitored" LJs - the users and communities I don't really read often, but occasionally (if you comment on my LJ you're not in the 'monitored' filter; that's mostly for those who I've friended to read every so often but don't consider them acquaintances).

Today, the author/artist of Peach Fuzz posted a mini-review of the Howl's Moving Castle movie (no spoilers) where she noted that she didn't have high expectations going in because she heard that the movie's heroine was an old woman. Quoted:

When I originally found out that much of the movie was about a girl in the form of a 90-year old woman, I had my doubts that she would make for a very likable or appropriate lead character. You generally expect your main character to be vibrant or youthful or energetic (not that the lack of dissuaded me from seeing it, obviously.)

I have to say that I don't think we have the same conception of what makes for a good lead character. Which probably explains why I don't like her manga and can't stand any of the characters.* What I look for in a lead character is depth. I like it when aspects of their personality or history are hidden, so you have to poke at them and peel them away to reveal what makes them tick and who they are. I like it when they have contradictions and paradoxes which turn out to make perfect sense once you dig deep enough. I actually loathe most genki-type characters, and they have to have deeper, more serious sides to them revealed early enough on to get me to like them.

Goku, Tohru Honda, and Naruto are characters that I wouldn't normally like if they didn't have their serious sides revealed early enough -- Naruto starts off in a cranky, prankster mood, and it's revealed that he usually shoves his doubts under a confident facade. Goku was played off of three not-genki characters before we started learning his tragic backstory, and he does show very deep currents of fear for what he's capable of doing. Tohru Honda is shown as very deliberately placing her negative emotions underneath her surface because she's got such an inferiority complex that she thinks she doesn't deserve any sort of happiness, and you get hit with that the moment the book starts, when she's living in a tent instead of imposing on anyone. If we'd met her before her mother died, I wouldn't have liked her as much, I think, because I think that her insecurites all stem back to that one issues.

There's supposed to be a meeting at work now - will come back if I think of anything, or a better way to say something. [ edit ] Cancelled, it seems. At least nobody's showing up to it. Not that I have anything else to say.

* I don't hold that against her, though, I am just emphatically Not Her Audience, and I enjoy reading her posts about learning how to be a professional mangaka. Caveat posted to head off any "If you don't like her, why do you read her LJ?" cries, although I think most of my regular readers are sensible enough to understand where I'm coming from without me having to spell it out.

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I have to admit that I picked up Fruits Basket on a lark. I figured that I would try an issue or two just to see if it was my sort of thing. Everything about the manga struck me as the sort that I really dislike, and despite all of that, it is compelling and an utterly fascinating read. I think you've hit it exactly. It's the depth of the characters, not just Tohru, but all of them, that really takes it up a notch.

I wonder if the mangaka of Peach Fuzz has had any exposure to classic literature. Granted, it's entirely a value judgement on her part-- especially as it's her review of the movie, but that's such a superficial comment.

I'm with you, there. It's no surprise I really can't enjoy her work. I can't even tolerate it.

I had the same concern.

It isn't because I think protagonists have to follow a certain model! Literature can be about anyone it pleases. But this is anime, where the main character is almost always the most beautiful. Disney movies do the same thing, with two exceptions (Beaty and the Beast, the Hunchback of Notre Dame), and they even go a step further by making all the villains ugly. Western movies do the same thing! It's a visual shortcut, like rain. A pretty face doesn't guarentee a likeable character, but it does make it easier to like a characer.

That said, this is Miyazaki and I should have had more faith. I'd like to point out that Sophie was by no means an ugly old woman. She was cute.

XD I don't like it's being shallow to expect anime to be pretty.

Honestly, I'm interested in seeing Howl's Moving Castle just *because* it has an 'old woman' in the lead (well, that and the whole 'Must see everything Studio Ghibli does' thing). However, this brings something to the forefront I've never actually noticed before.

That something? I just don't see a lot of movies with non-youthful-looking women in the lead (I may be wrong- and I'd love to be wrong here). Yes, there'll occasionally be the 40+ actress, but she's always plastered with makeup (or, in video games and animation, looks like she merely a twenty year old with a few wrinkles around the eyes, if any).

Now, bear with me on this point. Think of male actors. Sean Connery. Morgan Freeman. John Wayne. The weathered look goes far for guys. Now, I'm not going to say this is is some scheme or anything- damn it, Sean Connery looks better (IHMO) nowadays than when he was playing James Bond. But why are we, as a society of happy media-ingesting people, able to accept that, and not, say, a woman who actually has that same rough sort of beauty? Is it society, or is it just the way we are?

*coughs* Damn, got on a tangent on a comment thread. @_@ Going back to Howl's Moving Castle, I know that this age is a result of a curse, not actual time, but I think it's something completely new, and I, for once, am ready to go see it.

hmmn do kids 'really' want bubbly stuff all the time, doesn't explain the HP phenom. I love HP, but I always think it's a bit dark for children. Then again nothing seems to phase kids these days. Well, I thought my stories were dark and most people are like 'aww it's cute and sweet' O_o

I agree with you on that. I think a strong character - like Sophie, in "Howl" - is good no matter what age or sex. I personally usually like characters less if they're "genki" or "cute", but more if they seem to be one of those, but are much deeper than at first appearance. Thus, Naruto himself is a character I love, because despite the way he acts, he actually does have the burden of having been hated by so many people for no reason - and now that he has friends, the fact that he doesn't take them for granted as so many anime characters do makes me like him even more. I like many characters for traits based on what I would like real people for, and I think there are many people who don't. There are, of course, the fangirls who say "I like [for instance] Sasuke, because he's so cool and keeps himself away from everyone!" but to me it's more of "I don't like Sasuke because he acts like an asshole." This isn't bad, I don't think, I just don't understand only watching anime to idolize things you would hate in real life.

I just realized I am beggining to rant, so I shall stop now.

...

You know, you say you have nothing against me personally, but this isn't the first time you've verbally attacked me on your livejournal and jumped to conclusions*.

For the record, I was totally cool with your disagreeing with me on my livejournal (well, less of a disagreement, and more of just a big misunderstanding). I like honest feedback. But don't you think it's a bit tactless to go and publicly pick apart on your LJ what amounts to a quick comment, intended just for the people on my journal, and hardly what I'd consider a "mini-review"?

By quoting only half of what I said, you inadvertently (deliberately?) muddled my message, and then you twisted my words to mean something entirely different by following up with an essay about character depth--something I wasn't even talking about. I don't think my intended message was all *that* hard to understand. God forbid, I had some apprehensions about a movie starring a character taking the form of an old lady. Are you going to jump to the conclusion now that I have something against old people?

And then, when a couple people followed up to your post with the same concern I had, sub_divided, for example(http://www.livejournal.com/users/telophase/174502.html?thread=1297318#t1297318), you asserted that, no, no, that's not what minakokenshou meant at all. Because you can read minds, obviously.

For example: "minakokenshou wasn't apprehensive about Sophie because Sophie was ugly in her old-lady form, it was because she wasn't young and energetic and vivacious.[1] It's a personality thing, rather than an appearance thing." I'm sorry, but at what point did I say any of that to you? You're representing what *you* believed to be the case as cold, hard facts.

Or how about when you said that I "had a few assumptions about what a 90-year-old character would be like." I clearly stated that I knew the premise was a girl taking the form of a 90-year old woman, so how could you say matter-of-factly that I was assuming anything about Sophie's personality?

I would appreciate it if you would stop representing your assumptions about me as facts.

* http://www.livejournal.com/users/telophase/153863.html?thread=1141511#t1141511
This part being the most important: "which was released to nowhere near as much acclaim as they'd hoped" How do you know how much acclaim I was hoping for? For the record, I'm *extremely* happy with the success of the CD. We went through multiple printings of it, it was carried through stores like Animenation, and distributed by Diamond. I don't think that's too bad for a self-published CD.

P.S. You keep talking about how much you hate my Peach Fuzz book ("Which probably explains why I don't like her manga and can't stand any of the characters"), but you've previously admitted to having never even read it ("I really don't want to pick up the book"). And no, the RSOM entry doesn't count. A number of people who disliked the RSOM entry turned around their opinions completely after reading the book--there is, after all, quite a time elapse between the hastily put together short story and the graphic novel. I can understand you're not being my target audience, but going back to your most recent post, how can you sit there and talk about how I apparently don't know how to write characters when you haven't even read my book?

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